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GAMEDAY – Brentford Away (Take Two)
Blues take on managerless Brentford in their rearranged fixture tonight following a disappointing defeat to now-managerless Rotherham at the weekend.
Brentford
The big news from Griffin Park is that Marinus Dijkhuizen along with his assistant Roy Hendriksen were given the Spanish Archer on Monday, with former Blues midfielder Lee Carsley promoted to the top job until the end of the season.
His first managerial job in football sees him with a few injuries to contend with; Akaki Gogia, Phillipp Hofmann and Maxime Colin are all injured while James Tarkowski is suspended with the rumour on the BBC website that Carsley will have to look to u21 players to fill in the gaps in the squad.
Brentford lie in 19th place with eight points from eight games; they’ve won two games in nine in all competitions this season including a 4-0 thumping at home to Oxford United in the cup.
Blues
Clayton Donaldson and Andrew Shinnie are both rated 50/50 to start this one meaning Nicolai Brock-Madsen is on alert to make his first start since signing for the club. Rowett could shuffle his pack somewhat following the disappointing result at the weekend, potentially bringing in David Davis into the Blues midfield.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see a complete tactical reshuffle; as well as Donaldson leads the line I’m not sure Brock can do the same thing and I wouldn’t be massively surprised to see Jon Toral pushed up alongside him. That would mean the two wide players playing more withdrawn roles than they do in the 4-2-3-1; whether that means Jacques Maghoma coming in I’m not sure.
If Donaldson and Shinnie both miss out I think we’ll potentially see Alex Jones make his first squad appearance on the bench along with Koby Arthur or Reece Brown.
Ref
Keith Hill is in the middle for this one. He’s shown 30 yellow cards in nine games, and three reds. Ominously, his last Blues game was the 8-0 mauling by Bournemouth, in which David Edgar was sent off on seven minutes.
Suspension Watch
3 Yellow Cards: Maikel Kieftenbeld and David Cotterill
2 Yellow Cards: David Davis and Jon Toral
1 Yellow Card: Tomasz Kuszczak, Michael Morrison, Jonathan Grounds, Stephen Gleeson, Clayton Donaldson, Jonathan Spector and Demarai Gray.
The cutoff date for 5 yellow cards to attract a suspension is November 30, 2015
The cutoff date for 10 yellow cards to attract a suspension is April 9, 2016
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Tags: Alex Jones, Andrew Shinnie, Brentford FC, Clayton Donaldson, Lee Carsley, Nicolai Brock
104 Responses to “GAMEDAY – Brentford Away (Take Two)”
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Gray must be relieved of his defensive duties to get the best out of him.
A tactical formation change or to give him the number 10 role in place of Toral / Shinnie.
In the present formation both Gray and Cotterill ( both of whom cannot tackle) have so much tracking back to do that it limits their best asset…..ATTACKING!
I’d like to see Dimmi in the no.10 role as I think he’s more effective going forward in that role rather than on the wing as his crossing has been pretty much non existent of late. Problem is in the modern day football whatever role you are in you are expected to track back & help the defence, it’s all part & parcel of the game now & if he was in the no.10 role being in the middle means he would need to get stuck in even more.
Totally agree Rich.I think Rowett has been found out some what.
As Richard said, Cotterill and Gray are being wasted by being used as auxiliary full backs a lot of the time. If you want that type of wide player, then Maghoma on the right and Hancox on the left would do that job better. Mr Rowett’s system has worked well for us so far, so it’s hard to be too critical, but I don’t think it gets the best out of players like Gray, Cotterill and Donaldson… and they’re the ones that should be making the difference. Personally, I would give 4-3-3 a try.
Kuszczak
Caddis Morrison Spector Grounds
Kieftenbeld Gleeson Davis
Cotterill Donaldson Gray (or Maghoma)
You were almost correct. We stifled them for 65 minutes keeping ten men behind the ball, then brought on Mahogma on the left and put at No. 10 in the middle. The change was very effective
Whatever the selection and without naming names it’s pretty obvious we need to tighten up in defence where the problems are bigger than the argument of just needing another CB. In midfield accepting we are not enjoying the creativity from the loanees of last season we need to get some bite, accuracy and uplift in tempo back in to our game. Upfront we are looking impotent. Yes a tactical change perhaps needed here and getting more players in to the final third. Worried about carrying a striker who is very much work in progress in a small squad. I’m sure GR has worked out why we have gone off the boil far better than me.
I read an interview with Gleeson yesterday & he wasn’t making any excuses for saturdays performance but he felt maybe the vile game took a lot more out of them than a normal league game, which is fair enough I suppose as it was a big occasion for the majority of those players & they did put a lot onto it. He went on to say that he couldn’t wait for tonites game so as to put things right & with that in mind if the rest of the players feel that way maybe GR should play the same team (depending on availability). Ok I know i’m contradicting myself as i’ve been shouting for a change of system etc but on this occasion give the players a chance to redeem themselves.
I hinted at that in the last blog Chris. I wouldn’t be surprised if the same XI take to the field tonight, subject to availability. Correct me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t Rowett usually give the players another chance to make up for a poor performance?
Ye I think so staffs, lets hope they’re as fired up this tuesday as last. In all honesty I think they owe it to themselves to prove the doubters wrong.
As previously commented-give our defence a night off and get our attacking players on fire. Get a goal in each half and not sit back. My only worry is the continued use of Gray. Waiting and waiting we always are to the detriment of the other 10 players. Maghoma right-Cotts. left and take your pick from Arthur,Toral,Shinnie etc for the middle attacking spot. We have the players to win tonight,it is a case of GR using his talents to deliver-defeat and jury will begin to be assembled.
Actually, if he’s fit, Arthur might be a good shout for the No.10 spot. He has good feet and a decent shot on him.
Rowett “found out” ? Here is a manager who has had precious little to spend, uses most of the players which Lee Clark had, and has managed to make a very good job of our playing resources. We cannot win or even play well every game with the players we have and I think the expectations have been raised unjustifiably. GR is not infallible but his after-match interviews are fair & lucid and shows he has intelligence. I know comparisons are odious (excuse the cliche) but look at that deluded porky-teller from not that far away.
While there is no denying that GR has improved the perfomance of certain players, I still have to be convinced about his tactics, the results we have seen so far have had a lot to do with work rate more than quality, we know we are weak in area’s of the game but to win we have to score goals I would like to see Gray in the number 10 and given a chance to prove himself, and if he is still struggling then pack his bags off to West brom in January.
I see we have just completed the signing of defender Emmanuel Mbende from Borussia Dortmund, Welcome aboard Emmanuel. Now lets sign a striker..Kro
The club never announced it until today… but Mbende himself tweeted yesterday that he’d finally signed a contract.
4-3-3 for me to staffs with same line up as you say .. Give it a go because Rowetts prefered system is a bit stagment at present .. Brentford are struggling and have injuries so defeat tonight and the rot as certainly set in .. A win and we’re back on track and a good day in Leeds on Saturday to look forward to . Kro
I don’t see any reason why we can’t try it Dave. If it doesn’t come off, make sure we have the personnel on the bench to change it. Opposition teams are finding it too easy now to combat our 4-2-3-1, so give them something else to think about.
And if Donaldson does not make it then just bring in Brock – madsen and play same formation .. Agreed why not?? KRO
Yep. Agreed. It’s all about getting the support up there. I see no reason why it shouldn’t work with Brock-Madsen too. Got to be better than hoofball.
I agree with that. If Don is injured then Brock-Madsen will have been copying him to take his place. This is an away game so our game plan should fit that. Making multiple changes is experimental and is desperation. Two changes at most.
I am not going to put forward possible changes we need to make to the team for the Brentford game as it just seems to me that the whole squad has its limitations no matter who we play.
As Daniel has pointed out we have quite a small squad mainly due to Rowetts choice, and I think we have maybe made a mistake in letting to many players (or at least one) player out on loan that we should never have done so, and that is Thomas. We should be working on a plan “B” and that should be based on a 442 with a Thomas and Donaldson pairing. I cant understand why Gary brought off Davis in the vile game other than he was getting a bit hot under the collar so to speak. But then why did he drop him for the Rotherham game, I happen to think he (Gary) will bring him back tonight and so he should imo also our strength and the reason for our good start to the season was down to a settled team so lets stop all the rubbish about being tired and to many games and get back to a settled team. Tbh I couldn`t believe my ears when Rowett first started banging on about to many games baring in mind that they had just retuned from a two week break for the internationals and that we had only played 5/6 games of the season anyway prior to that break. Good god Gary stop giving them excuses to perform life less games like we have since the Break, and don`t worry to much lads you will all be getting another two weeks of again quite soon.
Good points made zxcv. What would throw Brentford a little would be the choice of not playing Brock should Donaldson not play. Big CF these days do not usually play for the promoted chasing teams. Agile,skillful do. Middlesbrough,Hull,Ipswich,Burnley,Derby keep the ball on the deck. However I do realise we haven’t the players to equal those mentioned- perhaps two-Arthur and Gray. These two could do it but their brains would need adapting to the role.Toral could but not hungry enough or clinical.( exception being Burnley away). Sadly we keep having to remind ourselves of these isolated goals as with Gray against Wolves etc.
I think on our day we have enough to beat or give a good game to any team in this division, but what we do not have is the squad that has enough variety of abilities and sills to enable us to have more than just one very basic game plan. That in the main will get us results along with hard work and a battling ability. Unfortunately that won`t get us to where we want it to be and I never expected it to but a good start has undoubtedly wetted all our appetite`s and we want more of the same please. Now I think like I have said before on here we should not of gotten carried away on a good start and continue to hope and pray for some good news to come out of HK, AND more importantly some money (as promised) for Gary to get in a couple of decent defenders ((CH and LB) IN THE NEXT WINDOW. Maybe then we can stop putting so much pressure on the likes of Grey to help out with defensive duties and allow him and others to concentrate a little more on what he does best and allow him to develop that defensive side of his game when he has concord his offensive side a little more. So unless we get funds to buy an established c/h and a decent LB then I fear we are going to end up being that mid table team a lot of people expected us to be. What ever happened to the promise of “the best part of the loan” from TTA that would be spent on the team. Half a million is not best part of 13 million quid.
I respect Mr Rowett’s opinion most of the time, but I’m afraid his decision to let Thomas go out on loan was a huge rickett.
Absolute not. He’s a League One player, like Novak
There’s a decent preview of the game at beesotted.co.uk. Gives the best places to eat and drink too.
Can’t see the eat and drink page
Looking at it know it does look like letting Thomas go was a mistake but we’re only saying it because of the last four games .. Beaten vile, beaten Rotherham then it would not have been an issue but it’s always regrets when things are not going so well … Hindsight is a great thing . Kro
Have to disagree on that a little bit Dave. Whether we’re winning or losing, to let a player like Thomas go is daft. He always gave us something a bit different, pace and power. We don’t have an alternative to the long ball to Donaldson now.
Exactly
Thomas is absolute garbage, he can’t score goals, ball at feet he can’t take anyone on, he’s league one, he’ll do ok for Swindon but he’s not a championship player, weren’t exactly a queue of championship clubs clambering for his services, you say pace and power? He’s not that quick, puts himself about a bit but when he’s got the ball he looks clueless, whenever he comes on we look blunt, flat and like we wouldn’t score if we played all week
Lee, very well said
That’s fair enough staffs I agree that we should have kept Thomas but we didn’t so Mr Rowett has to find another solution . Kro
He can`t he has no money and if he did its to bloody late now until January.
As I said he has to find another solution!! KRO
Dave, the problem he has is exactly what he said he wouldn`t do and that is bring in players who didn`t improve on what we already have. We can cover for players but that is all imo. We can`t change Spector for example, same goes for Grounds yet both are costing us points. Its going to take a fair few quid to replace them with better and then keep them as back up to the better new players. We do not have those replacements within the club mate so there is no solution and swooping the deck chairs around is not an option.
I’m expecting it to be K; C,M,L,G; D,Sp; G,M; T; B-M
Koby Arthur should be the one to replace Wes Thomas, the kid was excellent in that position whilst out on loan and he should be given that opportunity at Birmingham.
He impressed me more than anyone during pre season but nothing seems to have happened with him breaking in to the first eleven , strange . Kro
Have to say I was impressed with both Koby Arthur and I would also like to see Viv Soloman given a chance, Problem is if it doesn`t work out after a couple of games the pressure would be on to change it back to the tried and trusted, think I would play them both off the bench for a decent time maybe Half an hour at least and see how they get on. Viv looked very useful when he came on last week.
Couldn’t agree more mate , koby & soloman given a chance to shine .. We need to mix it up a bit I think . Kro
StaffsBlue and a few of us have been critical of Gray lately. On reflection I am getting the impression contractural situations are dictating things here. Drop him and a valuable asset dilutes at a time when TTA and possibly others are looking for diamonds within. We obviously will never know-but thought this could be the reason as to his continued inclusion into the first eleven.
That’s a bit like having a loan player that has to play every game. Ridiculous…. but you never know eh.
The very same thought crossed my mind Yesterday mate, I feel sure any other player would be side lined by now if I am honest.
It’s gotta be Mitchell because on form this season he should not be in the first eleven .. Warming the bench at best and that’s from someone who misses first game of the season tonight .. I think ime in the majority of fans in that we think the same . Kro
I honestly do not believe Rowett is playing Gray because he has to. If Rowett sees fit to drop the kid, he will. To be honest I am sick of seeing reports linking him with a move, the latest being West Brom. It must be unsettling for Gray too as he has only just commited himself to the club.
It should only be unsettling if either the club wants to sell him, or he wants to leave. If neither of those things are true, then I don’t understand why he would be unsettled.
Just seen a vine on the Blues wall, and these were the shirts hanging in the away dressing room.
Kuszczak, Grounds, Morrison, Robinson, Kieftenbeld, Gray, Gleeson, Donaldson, Solomon-Otabor, Brown, Maghoma, Toral, Spector, Arthur, Lowry, Caddis, Legzdins, Brock-Madsen
Robbo and Davis in, for Spector and Toral (who are on the bench.)
4-5-1. KRO
Other than Robbo, it looks like the team I listed earlier. Wonder if it will be 4-5-1 or 4-3-3?
Depends which way we’re going staffs ? Kro
That’s what I was thinking Dave. We’ll see what Tatts says later.
He would be unsettled wondering if the club will sell him because it would be no surprise to anybody would it?
But surely he would have had assurances on that score before he signed his new contract. Wouldn’t he? :-/
I don’t know staffs but the concern is the so called release fee which seems to have dropped to £ 3.5 Mill. It unsettles me!
As I said the other day andy, if £3.5m is the starting price, I could understand it. With add ons, it could reach an acceptable price. But £3.5m for him to leave would beggar belief, after what we turned down in the summer. I don’t think TTA or Pavlakis would be that stupid.
I think Gary has been on here today reading my posts about Spector, Funnily enough my mate called me earlier and we discussed the defensive problems and I ended up betting him that Robinson would be in tonight so £10 on its way. lol
Also said Davis needs to come back in and should never have been left out the Rotherham game
Clever you mate ! Kro
Not really should have done him for hundred quid lol, I am just hoping he now gives Viv Soloman a decent run out maybe a good half hour or more. Be nice to bring him on if we were 2 or3 goals to the good Dave.
Yes he looks jaded but give him a break chaps. None of them have looked on Fire recently. Bench have added nothing in last few games. Perhaps time to selectively use Arthur and Brown. Toral going off the boil compared with early on makes a big difference in the final third. All forgotten if we win tonight. Getting really tight in the Championship.
Mate it must be fairly bad for Gary to bring in a 37 year old, lets be honest but lets also say its not Spectors fault he is not a centre half by any stretch and he has given his best. We 100 per cent failed in the window in that position.
I’m not a fan of Spector at centre back, but I didn’t think he deserved to be dropped after Rotherham where he was one of the few better players. I expect he’s been rested.
According to Tatts, the formation will be similar to the villa game. Gleeson sitting deep with Kieft and Davis in front.
Btw, if Blues were to lose tonight, it would be the first time Rowett has lost three-in-a-row as a manager.
No Spector, No goals………………. Against. sorry but the truth
We won 2-0.. 5th in the league and clean sheet .. The problem is?? Kro
Brentford hit the bar, then we scored our second 8 minutes later. That’s the way to do it. Morrison actually scored! I heard he was treated for a nosebleed after scoring. ;)
Good team and system selection. Good 3 points. Well done lads. On to Leeds!!
Tricky game to play for us but we came through it in the end. We played a patient game & it paid off.
Crikey! What happened at the end there? I was cacking myself reading the BBC sport live match commentary when Brentford got all those corners in extra time but then suddenly the commentary stops and it goes from 0-1 to 0-2 at FT. No explanation on how Donaldson got that late goal. Love to hear….Dave???
Sloppy defending caused a lot of the corners then we broke & Donaldson was one on one & the rest is history as they say.
Tatts: “Gleeson toe-ends the ball away to break up a Brentford attack in midfield and it goes straight between the centre-halves. Donaldson is away, draws the ‘keeper and scoops a left foot prod over him as he goes down, it drifts into the net.”
Ta Staffs and Atko. I guessed it was against the run of play..they must have had 10 men in our half. Great win.
Well done Blues. Great response to Saturday. Gray played the full 90 minutes in an attacking role and was in no way a passenger if the radio commentary was anything to go by. I’m just glad it’s Gary Rowett picking the team and not some supporters based on a few daft comments on here today. 5th place – fantastic. Let’s get behind our players – especially the younger ones who may be going through a poor patch of form.
Gray was poor unfortunately. He had a lot of the ball but made the wrong choices most times & should have scored at least one. He just won’t take players on, he can learn a lot from Maghoma who came on & had a great run but unfortunately his finishing was as bad as Gray’s. At least he will take people on though. I’m not one for criticizing our own players but sorry, Gray did not have a good game. I think a rest is overdue for his own sake but like you say, we don’t pick the team. On a positive note though, good result, we had to work hard for it & be patient & we came through.
Grays been poor all season .. What’s new? KRO
Fair play Shirley Blue, I have been one of the critical bunch regarding Gray. So pleased he has responded well tonight. Great confidence boost for Leeds.
A wins a win .. Yeah of course it is .. Remember we’re 3rd equal points . Stop the criticising ! KRO
Reverse psychology, always a winner, hey Dan?
5th from bottom … We need to improve massively ……….,, oh sorry 5th from top , didn’t realise from some fans responses .. Wow .kro
Completely agree Dave, one of the the big keys to this league is when you are not playing that well, get points!
Exactly Bradley, it’s less stress full to be positive than negative , to be happy than sad … Live and learn I say ! .. But the boring ones can’t , kro
As I said on the Blues Player at half time, happy to take each game as they come & not worry about league position. I’ll see where we are at the end of the season. Getting caught up in talk of promotion/playoffs etc just puts unnecessary pressure on the team when we have a slight slump like the last 2 games. A lot can be said for a ‘if we win then celebrate, if we lose then forget it & look forward to the next game’ philosophy. You’ll enjoy your football a lot more that’s for sure! ;)
At the end of the day, all we can hope for is that we improve each season. Even 9th place would be an improvement.
That’s my philosophy atko .. Keep it that way !! Kro
Great result but yet again Gray is a passenger. We all know what he is capable of but he is either holding back or his heart is somewhere else. Dimmi is not really making mistakes but he is guilty of trying to play everything too safe. We used to get a buzz when he got the ball because he was adventurous and would be willing to run at defenders, now he seems incapable of beating his man and how many times does he get the ball and we all hope for a burst of pace and skill and yet all that we see is a safe back or sideways short pass. Just in case you subscribe to OP – C’mon Dimmi express yourself in the way we know you can, even the anticipation of you getting the ball was the reason we all loved to see you in Royal Blue, yes you’ll make mistakes but those magic moments will return.
Gray took on his man tonight and more.
Kford blue nose. Where you actually at Brentford last night, in fact do you go to any matches? Gray certainly wasn’t a passenger. Yes I’ll admit he’s been a little disappointing in some games this season and sometimes needs to pass the ball instead of trying to beat players and be a little steadier in his shooting but he does a dam sight more defensive work than Cotterill or some of the midfielders and had to get Grounds out of a situation on more than one occasion. It’s about time people who criticism him remember he’s only a young lad learning his trade and many players have a significant dip in form in their second season.
Wasn’t at Brentford so does that mean I can’t have an opinion?? Sick of the he’s only a young lad BS, at the end of the day I don’t judge him on his defensive attributes and it’s not his efforts at the back that have prompted teams to show an interest in him. We all know he can do a lot more as an attacker which is why you obviously believe he is having a dip in form in his second season. I’ve been supporting my home town club for over forty years, some seasons as a casual supporter, some as a season ticket holder and some where I’ve struggled to go at all for various reasons. My wife and kids are all bluenoses, not by choice but because it’s our city and whether we are good, bad or indifferent no-one but a bluenose has the right to criticise. That’s what I am and if I aint happy about something then that’s what I’ll do. Differences of opinion are what the game is all about. I never boo or jeer any of the lads, I might swear under my breath but they have my full support when they have got the shirt on.
What magic moments ?? Kro
How about the hat-trick before half time against Reading and the winner against Wolves.
Few and far between Shirley , few and far between. Kro
For the attention of Mr. Mann. When you visit Leeds on Saturday, would like your views on striker Antenucci. This forward to me has the lot- brave,aggressive,fast and sniffs goals. He is an Horsfield/Kevin Philips type suited 100% for Blues. My reason for asking is this:- come transfer window in January I intend e-mailing GR suggesting we go for Antenucci offering money plus Donaldson. Believe me this player could just keep us in the converted 5/6 spots throughout the season. Cannot think of a level headed/fair minded person to assess. Thanks.
Thanks Mitchell , I will keep an eye on him but I hope he has a stinker . KRO
If we were winning everything, keeping clean sheets every week, then most people on here would have nothing to say, but we did win last night and kept a clean sheet, well done team. 9 games in and 15 points and 5 place on goal difference, still a long way to go but enjoying the season and nice to be talking football with no mention of relegation zone or twat manager thats unless your vile, Kro
I’m trying not to be too negative about Gray but too it’s once too often it feels like we are playing with 10 men. He has got bags of potential but we would like to see a bit more of it before he eventually leaves, which he is bound to do at some point in the not too distant future. We have always forgiven a player who is willing to work his socks off even if they haven’t been blessed with the silkiest of skills (just for the old gits amongst us, remember Dean Peer, not the most gifted by a long way but at least he would put a shift in).
Why always lay into Gray? There were worse players on the pitch than him on Saturday – Kelftenbeld and Toral too name two. GR made him a regular since he became manager and as far as I am concerned he has been a key player in a winning team since. How about actualy getting behind our players instead of constantly critising them. Last season it was Cotterill who got all the stick when he had a dip in form after xmas and all the moaners wanted him dropped. Why have some people always got to have a player to lay into – its pathetic. For us to be fifth with this squad is nothing short of a miracle. Enjoy it FFS.
I think we will get more points away from home this season purely because the pressure is off from getting away from all the moaning, booing, jeering so and so’s at home.. If you would really prefer watching the likes of Peer rather than an England U20 regular like Gray then you must have very low expectations in life.
Oh my god, have to agree with Shirley, Dean Peer was errr limited to say the least yes he would try but in all honesty was useless. Gray has been disappointing Iagree but you know he could do things Peer could only dream about.
My point is you can have all the ability in the world but if you don’t use it often enough you aint no use to anyone. We all know the limitations of some players (hence the reason I used Peer as an example) and you set your expectation levels to match their ability. My expectations of Gray are high because I know he has got the makings of a fantastic footballer and I get more frustrated when he doesn’t perform anywhere near the levels we all know he can. Just my opinion.
Another interesting coincidence, just yesterday on this site I commented on the mistake (imo) that Gary had made in letting Wes Thomas go out on loan, and with no recall. Well I see this morning Thomas is on his way back due to injury … just makes me wonder if we have found away around getting him back on board.
Is he on his way back? I saw an article which suggested he might but nothing official.
Even if he is… he’s not eligible to play for us until the loan period would have expired. Sorry to rain on your parade.
Scored his 2nd goal in two games for Swindon, then did his hamstring. According to Mark Cooper, he’ll be out for about a month. Nothing about him returning to us.
Let’s please not treat Gray as the finished article. He was plucked out of the Development squad early because we did not have a Championship standard left winger but he had the pace and skill to do a job.
TF Was setting the whole country alight when he was 16, Gray will never reach those heights then again no one will.