Often Partisan

Landmark Ruling Gives Carson Appeal Hope

A landmark ruling made yesterday in Hong Kong’s Court of Final Appeal has given Carson Yeung fresh hope that his own appeal against his conviction for money laundering will be successful. The Court of Final Appeal unanimously overturned the conviction of Pang Hung Fai for money laundering confirming that defendants needed more protection from the courts on the second limb of the offence.

The ruling, which can be read here confirms that the second limb should test if a defendant “would believe” that the money involved represented the proceeds of an indictable offence rather than “could believe”, which places a heavy onus on the defendant to prove their own innocence rather than on the prosecution prove their own guilt.

This is important to Carson because in his trial the prosecution made no effort to prove where the money that flowed through his accounts had come from or what it was the proceeds of, instead relying on the lack of records to prove that Carson was guilty of money laundering.

This new ruling makes Carson’s conviction a lot shakier and means that he could now well win on appeal – maybe in the Court of Appeal if he gets the right judges but he would definitely have a good chance in the Court of Final Appeal. The prosecution were criticised in Carson’s trial for withholding evidence they were compelled to hand over in court which indeed backed Carson’s story and he can use as a ground of appeal that the length of investigation hampered his defence as records were destroyed.

Will Giles, co-author of “Haircuts and League Cups” and solicitor in Hong Kong for 24 years said:

Carson has a good ground of appeal as the Judge never gave any weight to his own explanations of his conduct which the Court of Final Appeal have now said are relevant as to whether he had reasonable grounds to believe that the money passing through his accounts represented the proceeds of an indictable offence

Carson has been quietly assembling an appeal team over the past few months and while he has made an abortive application for bail he could now make a much stronger one which according to my legal sources in Hong Kong could well be accepted. Despite the perceived lack of funds that BIH have Carson has been able to maintain his legal team and it’s believed he will be using the services of a top English barrister to spearhead his appeal against his conviction.

For Blues fans, it makes the possibility of Carson coming back to St Andrews real. Carson was the driving force behind buying the club at BIH and while I think he’d sell it for the right price he definitely does still want to own the club. It’s now very possible he will play the long waiting game knowing that he could very possibly get his conviction overturned which would free him not only from prison but from the shackles of the “owners and directors test” and allow him to return as a director and/or owner of the football club.

Whether that will happen remains to be seen – but it means that in my mind there is absolutely no way the club will be sold quickly. Carson’s first appeal is likely to be heard in the middle of next year with any appeal to the Court of Final Appeal taking another 12-18 months after that. I can’t believe Carson will receive a heroes’ welcome back to St Andrews – indeed, I can’t believe he’ll be welcomed back at all but I don’t think that will bother him in the slightest should he secure his freedom.

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97 Responses to “Landmark Ruling Gives Carson Appeal Hope”

  • asif says:

    so thats bcfc fcuked for a while longer!!!!! it isnt going to get better any time soon. at least gary rowett has got the team playing better nd with fight. hey dan have you or do you get a chance to speak to gary?

  • Agent McLeish says:

    When will this farce ever end! BIHL are like an incurable festering disease affecting the club.

  • Eddie says:

    Carson out

  • Teamoftebilys says:

    Well I’m going to be the first to say it then – welcome back King Carson of Birmingham! All is forgiven, sorry about the mean songs and that, love you lots. Please give us some money.

  • Dino Tiltoni says:

    Carson’s return to St Andrews would be both daring and interesting!

  • Lee says:

    The law is an ass, he’s as guilty as hell, everyone knows it

    • almajir says:

      Lee

      I sat through most of the trial and I will tell you now we don’t know it, that’s the point. I’d like to think I know the evidence and the case fairly well and I thought the prosecution case was very poor.

      Just because you think that it doesn’t a) mean that everyone thinks it and b) that it’s true.

      Daniel

  • Bluesbot says:

    And I expect that the return of Carson will also mean the return of Peter Pannu, and I expect that to be sooner rather than later :(

  • Bluealex says:

    If he gets out, uses the 40 million he promise and gets us back to the prem then I think I could forgive him

    • tttpaule says:

      I would never forgive the horrible F–ker for what he’s put us the fans & our club through!! On the flip side i think I’ll take up hairdressing apparently there’s multi millions to earn legally. I think the club will stay on this downward spiral until these parasites disappear KRO.

  • Richard Granfield says:

    Shock Horror Carson is Innocent!

  • duchess says:

    At the risk of been unpopular, Carson did spearhead the finances behind the league cup win, it was poor management and leaving Kevin Phillips on the bench that got us relegated. I am sure nobody wants to be sent to prison especially if they feel they have done nothing wrong which it would appear CY and his team believe? Innocent until proven guilty is what I say and if CY had no chance to defend himself then who could he prove his innocence?… if the courts give him a second chance I think we should too! anyone who saw the plans for the new stand and his vision for the club must still be intrigued to see if he can do it?

  • Peter Bates says:

    Well I’ll say to mr yeung delay no more your not wanted at bcfc

  • Mineheadblue says:

    Yipeeee……….come back Carsen, all is forgiven!!!!!!! LOL

    (In reality, I feel like sticking my head in a bucket)

  • Mezz says:

    Just when things on the pitch were turning for the better this hits us. I’d like to see him try get back into St Andrews on a match day! Does he honestly think the fans would ever accept him back!!!

  • Adam McDermott says:

    Having read Dan’s & Will’s excellent book (shameless plug!!) and the Judgment from DJ Yau it’s totally clear that although Carson has many faults, not least extremely poor accounting skills, dubious business practices and being less than an honest witness – the prosecution never raised any evidence as to where Carson’s money came from. They even withheld evidence at Trial proving some of his money had come from legitimate sources !!

    The case alluded that the money came from nefarious sources and it may well be correct, but, there was absolutely nothing put to the Court to prove this. In the UK this charge wouldn’t even get past the CPS without evidence.

    In the UK he may well have been prosecuted for tax avoidance, falsifying accounts etc but the legal system in HK for such charges is guilty until proven innocent. He will appeal and will no doubt succeed, perhaps a re-trial if that is the way in HK.

    Upshot is that we’ve got Carson for some while yet and with the restrictions on BIHL in selling the club (being 95%+ or their turnover) in trances or wholly I can’t see us being bought any time soon.

    I can only see administration forcing Carson’s hand.

  • The Francis Fake says:

    It appears that the hierarchy at BIH (including Pannu) are split into 2 camps. CY and his cohorts are not interested in a sale in the hope of a successful appeal which would lead to a situation whereby his assets are unfrozen and can be utilised to reinvest into BCFC in order to make it a more saleable proposition or to try and maintain ownership for the long term. I would guess the other camp want to sell sooner rather than later as they have no interest in the club and simply want to maximise the price they can get, but, do not currently have enough control to force a sale. The problem for a sale is that it could only involve a complete sale of BIH as the preferred option of a phased sale of BCFC followed by a sale of the PLC after some kind of re-investment into some other trade is not feasible. When it became evident to all shareholders that they could only sell BIH in one hit this undermined greatly their potential return. The situation now is that BIH is only worth the value of a struggling Championship club as there is no intrinsic value in the plc, particularly is this is a company that has a lot of financial uncertainties that accountants can’t clear up due to the dreadful corporate governance in the early years of ownership. If you look at the history of events over the past couple of years I think that CY would have considered a phased sale as it would have generated an acceptable overall price, however, the problem now is BIH is not worth anything like what was anticipated 2 years ago. It appears that we are in a stalemate unless control is somehow wrestled away from CY and for this to happen other shareholders have got to invest more into the club to water down the shares controlled by CY.

  • Shane says:

    #freethecarsonone I have said it all along that he was holding on to the club until all avenues of appeal etc were exhausted he will ride back in to St Andrews in his Maybach and his Gorilla skin coat spend £20 million and get us back to the Premier League at this point I would also like to point out I have always felt that Carson was innocent and that Peter Pannu is a great man who tried so hard for our club KRO

  • Hillfield blue says:

    Can’t imagine CY walking down the steps to take his seat in the directors box at St Andrews somehow. I wouldn’t fancy it if I were him tbh.

  • Hillfield blue says:

    Can’t imagine CY walking down the steps to take his seat in the directors box at St Andrews somehow. I wouldn’t fancy it if I were him tbh.

  • Mineheadblue says:

    Sorry, I just had to do a second post because I think I’m experiencing hysteria. I’ve just started giggling insanely and tonight I will probably be howling at the moon. If someone had told us that all this would happen when Carsen bought the club, no one in their right mind would have believed it possible!! You simply couldn’t make it up……..

  • Dave mann says:

    18 months minimum of BIHL to come so I think we should all go out and celebrate this fantastic news, more players to leave, more heartache to go through, league one round the corner, admin round the corner…..thank god we’ve got sir Gary rowett for now but that could be the death nell for his departure if he does to we’ll and gets picked up by a premiership team…happy days are still here again!!.kro.

  • Chris W says:

    This is probably why Pannu is hanging around, as soon as CY wins his appeal PP1 will be on the first plane back to Hong Kong and PP2 will wing his way with his annoying smirk to really annoy us the supporters.
    Not good news for BCFC as it could taker another two years to reach a verdict.
    With all the bad feeling I doubt CY would be welcomed back, it would take a lot to replace all the angst surrounding CY and BIHL.
    Best solution all round would be for CY to sell up immediately and not think of setting foot in Birmingham, no smoke without fire in my book,
    KRO+DNM

  • DoctorD says:

    Things are looking up for Carson. I predict:

    a) he will still be at the helm in five years’ time
    b) we will be pushing for the play offs next year
    c) some of his early dreams of us being a force in China may yet come to pass.

    Even if we get within a sniff of the Premier League again, the fact that dollar signs will be dangling before the club will make us a prospect once again. We need to back Sir Garry Rowett and hope the team performs better on the pitch. It’s the only way forward. I think Rowett’s appointment is the start of the corner being turned.

  • mark says:

    well well well sorry i could not hold back my tears any more………….
    better inform the club cleaner the Daddy on his way home………..need to get that league cup looking sparkling ……..in our club cabinet…..kro

  • mark says:

    Daniel you might eventually get to interview him after all matey…..it appears their law ass….

  • Will says:

    The King is dead/Long live the King like a Turkey at Christmass anyway you look at it were stuffed for the next couple of years as far aas any outside investment goes

  • Will says:

    What happens to his assets that were frozen, would they be released at the same amount as before? therefore if he wished he could (I know it’s a long shot) start reinvesting in the team again, as an owner with a cleared reputation (In the eyes of the law and the FA
    if not the fans)?

  • Agent McLeish says:

    Maybe this is why PP1 has kept his grubby paws locked into the club. Another fat payday on the horizon maybe for Pointless Pete.

  • blue lizard says:

    Just as things seem to settle down a little along comes another kick in the bo****cks…They will ruin the club as long as they are any where near it and they wont give a stuff when it’s gone. Who would do business with Yeung unless they were hooky? and the reputation of the club would sink even lower..as for Pannu? just a greedy tosser…(my opinion and not influenced by OP)

  • BhamCityJulian says:

    Just as long as he doesn’t say this when he is acquitted: “Thank you. Does that mean I can keep the money?”

  • GarryRowettsBlueArmy says:

    If Carson does indeed get out of jail surely he will be looking to ‘cash out’ on business ventures and retire to a fancy home with a relaxing atmosphere?

    After a stressful few years i cant see why he would want to jump straight back in with the other mugs losing more money at BIHL when he can sell up and swap the office for an apartment in the bahamas…

  • AussieBlue says:

    Well Dan I read the whole tawdry appeal document an was particularly impressed by:
    “They would go diving every weekend and play ping-pong on Tuesdays.” (Appellant and Kwok).

    Mate, this ruling in my opinion will have no bearing whatsoever on Carson’s appeal. The circumstances are entirely different and the amount (about a million quid) much smaller.

    Unless the entire legal system in HK has been corrupted; which I seriously doubt, Carson will be spending all of his legitimate time behind bars. This does not help BCFC financially of course; you are right there.

    • almajir says:

      Andrew

      I have to be honest mate, I’m going to go with what I’ve been told by the solicitors in Hong Kong.

      • AussieBlue says:

        Hi Dan, yeah I can understand that but one ruling does not immediately affect other cases as each case is unique. The Pang Hung Fai case sounds like a dog’s breakfast. Kwok has disappeared and is probably fish food by now…clear case of a ‘cleanskin’ being used as a convenience to handle money assuming Pang didn’t have a clue. If the Carson case is appealed and it is ruled that the prosecution must show where the funny money actually came from….Carson might not want that to be found out!
        It’s Chinatown, man.

  • Brightside says:

    So my thoughts yesterday on the ‘which way to jump thread ‘were basically correct then….
    Just get down Stans and support the team. In GR we trust

  • raymondo says:

    I had a feeling that this turn of events was around but it’s happened quicker than I thought. This could help GR and perhaps discourage BIHL from selling our better players.

  • Mickey07 says:

    Yeung and pannu would need balls of steel to even think about showing there faces at St. Andrews again,over our dead bodies will they ever get near the gates of the club again…they are cancers the pair of them….

    • bluenose11 says:

      why what will we really do sing nasty songs at them and make them feel uncomfortable i see people saying they dare not this or they dare not that or they better not do this its all rubbish these chancers arnt scared of you or the bcfc crowd mate if they were they would have broken ages ago . no im afraid this bloke will stroll down the steps mate waving and we will boo but nothing else, not that im suggesting that we should but i for one would be interested to know what people think the reaction would be

      kro

  • nicko says:

    i should not worry to much about mr pannu.when is contract is up at bihl i believe they will let him go.he will not enter stans again

  • Art says:

    Yet another bad news day!

    It’s just like having a daily dose of “Chinese Water Torture”

    God I just hate these awful people.
    ,

    ,

    • Mickey07 says:

      I’m with you on this one they need chucking into a swamp of crocodiles…god riddance to bad Hong Kong rubbish…vile people.

      • Art says:

        How long will GR or any decent manager tolerate owners like we have?

        That’s the real issue!

        • mark says:

          he absolutely fine with it they employed him lol

          • Art says:

            Mark,

            GR apart from being a good manager is also ambitious and will want to take the club forward and yes he maybe ok with things at the moment but without investment the club is going nowhere .

            You maybe happy with this but I can assure you he won’t be.

            Under these owners there will be no investment and no hope.

          • mark says:

            dont worry he be able to use the skills he never thought he had….

  • Hullblue says:

    New song ? “We all care about Carson” , but not really likely from the Tilton

    Rotherham (New York Stadium !) here we come

  • bluenose08 says:

    will carson be entitled to compensation for wrongful imprisonment ?

  • Carl Richards says:

    Its all a bit dodgy but I have a novel idea, boycott until a sale goes through

  • WalmleySteve says:

    How is it that Yeung, with such a relatively small shareholding in BIHL (notwithstanding the convertible bonds he holds) can exercise such influence over a listed company to the extent that he can instruct its board of directors whether to and when to sell its major asset, i.e. BCFC? But then again, this is the organisation that deems Ryan Yeung as worthy of a seat on the board of its major asset despite a complete lack of business management experience. How the football league and Hong Kong Stock Exchange fail to see through all of this is beyond me.

  • what was that song by the jackson 5?

  • Bluenosesol says:

    1st win at home in yonks. 3 games unbeaten. New Manager. Bought my Rotherham and Blackpool tickets and booked my Blackpool hotel. Life is looking good, now this bloody cr*p! Joys and Sorrows eh?

  • raymondo says:

    If CY should be lucky enough to win this appeal he should get a lot of his “frozen” funds back and will I think have enough sense to invest BIHL into other ventures so that he can unload our club for sale. He knows he can’t come back here, nor his protege Pannu. He can’t be completely ignorant of what the fans think oh him. He would be bood from first whistle to last at any match he had the nerve to attend. Cheer up lads, the end is (relatively ) near. This is not and endless dark tunnel. I’ve always been impressed with the Wolves motto. “Out of darkness cometh light” They’ve just been through their darkness, it won’t be long before we are through our’s too. Let’s keep our heads up and give GR the support he deserves every week until we are free of this chinese affliction!

  • Pete says:

    Why do people think that he will have a lt of money after all this? His companies have all become worthless for the mot part. Also, why would he want to help a club he has a much lower shareholding in now, by giving millions for his tiny %…..

  • raymondo says:

    If he is in a position where he needs money, Pete, why doesn’t he sell the club?

  • raymondo says:

    I think I heard it said on this forum that CY is in a positionwhere by cashing in some sort of bonds he could become the major shareholder again. .Is that correct?

  • Blueboi14 says:

    Release the HK 1

  • Dave mann says:

    I’ve got more money in the bank than Carson yeung but I’ve got no intention of buying into blues because all I ever want to be is a valid and dedicated supporter so those of you who think he’s gonna put millions into the club on his return if that ever happens which his highly unlikely are deluded and unrealistic because it ain’t gonna happen..period!!!.kro.

  • Dave mann says:

    Bluenosesol, not only Blackpool mate but I along with the wife and son will by the drinks in Rotherham to…..looking forward to going to the New York stadium along with a trip upto Blackpool to see mr Clark and is deluded football team, should be great atmospheres with both being sell out for blues fans,lovely jubbly!kro.

  • Art says:

    Will you by the drinks at my local bar in Cyprus please-the bar is called the Tumba and will be full of very thirsty ex-pats who don’t have to drive.-a couple of grand should cover it!

  • paulo_bcfc says:

    He can take his money and shove it where the sun rises. Him and anyone connected to BIHL can ‘politely leave’. Do not need to say anymore.

  • Peter Bates says:

    It still appears to me that the Hong kongstock exchange are running bih what they says goes and it won’t matter who has most shares in bih

  • andy says:

    If Carson does come back to St Andrews and puts a piece in the match day programme apologising for the mess and embarrassment caused these past few years and then commits to taking the club forward, he should be welcomed back.

  • Hillfield blue says:

    The fact that this appeal process could take 18 months or so before he is cleared is the main problem for me. If it was done and dusted tommorow,I think the sale of the club would be a lot closer as any assets etc would become unfrozen and allow BIH to diversify their business which is what the HKSE want to see. As it stands at the momment,I can’t see how the club can ever be sold.

  • swissjonny says:

    We all need to stop projecting and enjoy life a day at a time.We cannot influence affairs in HK and in my humble opinion with Christmas,Chinese New Year and lawyers holidays etc this matter will not be concluded in the supreme court for at least 2 years.iThe only thing to do is to start relishing the small victories on the pitch and get behind GR.This is in reality all we can do.Carsen will have a much better legal team this time around but this does beg the question -who will be paying the fees? If the main barrister is the man I think it will be-a man with a liking for large lunches and top end grappa- he will charge for one court appearance and a little bit of preparation 500,000 HKD around 40 grand in real money.Carsens barristers fees alone could tot up to a couple of million quid for two appeals.On top of this he will have to fork out for juniors and solicitors etc.Where will all this money come from and who will pay it? An earlier comment mentioned that CY may not wish the source of the allegedly laundered money to be revealed.I agree with this and actualy think that CY is between a rock and a very hard place.Only time will tell.In the meantime come on you blue boys!

    • AussieBlue says:

      Completely agree with all that Swissjohnny. It was me who said Carson might not want the sources of the laundered money traced and made public in Court. Doesn’t help BCFC though; we are still like the Prisoner of Zenda; trapped in a vortex of intrigue, incompetence, market maneuverings and stuff we just can’t control. So yeah;….let’s enjoy the football and an unbeaten 3 game run!

  • Dave mann says:

    As we’ve said this could go on for a minimum of 18 months and then continue for a lot longer after that with these owners which means all those stay away fans who won’t go because of the owners will probably be concessionry come the time they renew because there all be at retirement age so enjoy your sabbatical and see you in many years to come if your eyesights still good and you can still get to the ground safely but until then enjoy your early retirement as a true supporter.kro.

  • Adam True Blue says:

    I am getting frustrated at the blinkered view of some contributors here, what makes blues fans believe that CY has ANY plans to sell the club? It might be what a lot of the fans desire but we live in the real world, from my perspective the guy thinks his freedom is around the corner and what ever plans he had in place before his committal he can now pursue to fruition whether we like it or not! If you think about it CY will have a point to prove to his peers on his release.

  • Dave mann says:

    Exactly Adam, the owners are going nowhere and there here to stay for as long as they possibly want…..the only thing is administration and that apparently is a million miles away so protest , banners, hatred chanting and constant abuse they get from us fans ain’t gonna make a squat of difference so why bother?kro.

  • Peter Bates says:

    Totally agree there feelings won’t be hurt a tad because they are selfish people who only think of themselves they won’t care about the fans as long as the club makes money for bih I suggest keep supporting the team and gr but boycott the commercial side of the club ie the shop and events that the club runs through events kro

  • mark says:

    looks like rowetts getting the backing from the owners regarding moussi hopefully we know soon…its all about the pennies…..

  • Dave mann says:

    That’s right Peter it’s not the players or the managers fault so why make them suffer the boycotts and lack of support from the stay away fans, it’s there choice of purse but I find it hard to understand that an afternoon shopping with the misses than going down the blues with there kids or with friends having a bevy or two and making a day of it…..very strange indeed.kro.

    • mark says:

      some cant be arse to pay the £25-£32
      must come back to the rotherham game i believe Dave we got another 300 tickets for that game, this will be extraordinary following imo

  • mark says:

    looks like rowetts wants to shift out three or four players, i wonder if any will bring any money in ?
    will liverpool return for gray?

    • mark says:

      also wants to bring in maybe three players by January i wonder if ones a striker that he maybe thinking about?? could done with the one that’s going for his previous job at Burton……it would have taken the hassle out of looking for one…….

      • Dave mann says:

        To right mark because our away support as always been absolutely magnificent wherever we’ve been and were be amongst that support at Rotherham and blackpool so can’t wait for that and yes I think Gary is looking at a striker or two amongst others so were see on that one !kro.

  • Will says:

    Can someone who speaks plain English tell me what the latest announcemsnts mean, the first relates to a capital bond issue being used by Tricor Tengis Limited Issue o f ordinary shares pursuant to
    conversion of Debt Convertible bond on
    14 November 2014
    2,700,000,000 Approximately 38.68% HK$0.030 HK$0.049 Approximately 38.78% discount and the second gives details of payments to Asia Ray’s AKA our beloved Mr Pannu as clear as mud can we just start scoring more goals thatn the opposition and maybe everything will sort itself out

    • swissjonny says:

      Basicaly Will from what you said someone lent money to the club in the form of a bond.When they agreed the loan or bond they negotiated the right to exchange the debt for shares at a certain price.They have therefore just exercised their right to convert.

  • Art says:

    Bih have made a declaration of intent to pay Pannu more money.His previous fees were capped but he wa paid more than the capping level and the board are now proposing and advising the HKSE that they intend to pay him more.

    You just couldn’t marke it up!

  • Dave mann says:

    To dissapear.kro.

  • Art says:

    I suspect this is the main reason why Panos has been so quiet !

    He’s privy to what’s going on but seems powerless to stop the wheeling and dealings which is clearly happeningin HK.

    In my view he’s not to be trusted either and I will continue not to line his or Pannu’ s pocket.

    The owners are a complete disgrace and are not fit to represent our great club.

    • mark says:

      Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzlol……..roll on Rotherham and Blackpool hey Dave get to see the lights….

  • Dave mann says:

    There not fit to own our great club but our manager is fit and our team besides the injuries are fit to along with the great support we get by those that do choose to go down to St. Andrews and a lot of the away games like yours truly are fit and worthy to represent our great club…..if you choose not as you put it line there pocket then that’s your loss because I look at it as me and my family lining out pockets with respect and recognition of those hard working staff members who work bloody hard to keep Birmingham city on the straight and narrow and its bloody childish in my opinion not to go down because of the owners…..your be gone for a long time , enjoy what ever else you do while the rest of us have great days out and get drunk and travel all over the country…in ain’t a bad life really if you put your childish grudges to one side!!!.kro .

    • mark says:

      Dave if not the owners it will the tea lady who gets it next for making crap tea……we won’t go down until the tea lady gone…lol


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