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Putting Your Money Where Your Mouth Is
Friday sees the end of what has been a pivotal week for Birmingham International Holdings – and by extension Birmingham City Football Club. With the announcement on Tuesday of new avenues of funding that to aid liquidity and cashflow for the next couple of years coupled with the eradication of the problematic loan from Carson Yeung to BCFC, it could be seen that things are rosier for Blues. Yet people are unhappy.
I’ve long had the impression that people have been waiting for Birmingham International Holdings to fail as a company or for the club to go into administration as for many people they think it’s the only way the club will be sold. I have to admit, I have too held the belief that the only way the club would be sold would be with as a deal with an administrator – but with the news that has been released this week I think opinions need to be revised.
The chief reason that I thought the club would need to go into administration to be sold wasn’t so much to do with the valuation of the club but to do with the few debts it had – specifically the debt the club had to Carson Yeung which was valued at circa £15million. When a new owner comes in they have to not only pay for the club they have to assume the debts – which means that on top of any price for the club they would have to negotiate a “haircut” of the debt to Carson (if they didn’t want to pay it in full). As I stated on this blog back in September, there were problems due to the fact the loan is covered under the restraint order (which means the Department of Justice of HK would need to agree any “haircut”) .
Furthermore, as has been stated repeatedly in the accounts and in past announcements there are issues that there is a lack of documentation for the money and one would think that any potential buyer would want something legally watertight to ensure that they didn’t receive a demand from someone else for the money down the line. Administration would have ensured that the debt was wiped and thus there would have been a “clean slate” making for an easier purchase; it appears that BIH have managed to solve this problem without the need for a painful administration process and whoever came up with the idea needs to be applauded.
The fact remains that at this moment in time Carson Yeung is in no rush to sell the club unless his price is met – and as much as people want him to sell it unless they have a spare £32million to buy it there isn’t much at all that can be done to sway his mind. Even his potential incarceration doesn’t necessarily force him out, as he doesn’t have the required shareholding to be properly considered as an “owner” under football league rules and I believe that the justice system will not be able to start the confiscation process until the appeal process is exhausted – a procedure that could easily take years.
The impression I get is that he (or BIH) are close to securing some sort of investment in the club from selling a stake (approximately one-quarter) of the club. If he has managed to sell the stake under his terms the agreement that has been bandied around would see the sale completed around the end of the season (provided BIH has been relisted) – and it is my hunch that that investment/purchase would come from someone either in Hong Kong or China.
I’ve seen the wailing and gnashing of teeth that the club may remain in foreign ownership and I have to admit that I don’t fully understand it. I don’t think it matters where the money for the club is coming from as long as someone invests in it – the club is run well here in Birmingham and realistically just needs a capital injection to ensure that it can compete on the pitch a bit better. If this money comes from a Chinese investor then it’s the way it is – if it pays for new players, a bit of improvement to the ground or the like are people really going to be upset?
One thing that crosses my mind is that rather than protest, rather than boycott there could be another avenue for fans to make their voices heard – and that’s to come together to build a stake of their own. I’ve seen plenty of calls for fan ownership in clubs and it’s something I agree with but – and it’s a big but – I think people need to realise that a stake in the club has to be bought rather than given away. If fans are so incredulous as to what is happening it surprises me that no one is looking to put together money to buy a stake in BIH (when it is relisted) for example so that they can put pressure on the board of directors from a legal standpoint. If fans can’t put their money where there mouth is why should they expect anyone else to?
Tags: BIH, Carson Yeung, HK, HKSE
118 Responses to “Putting Your Money Where Your Mouth Is”
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Great comment piece Dan.
Like you I feel more optimistic following this weeks announcement. Wiping off Carson Yeung’s debt is a massive step forward and the prospect of a cash injection for BIHL must be a good thing. We shall just have to wait and see how this affects the club.
As I’ve said before:
Why the complaints? BCFC are debt free so the main obstacle to sales had been removed. CY has lost £15m by converting his loan into currently almost worthless shares; the shareholders of BIH have lost £50m+ from Grandtop’s original purchase of the club.
If someone is investing now it’s clearly not to asset strip but to make a quick buck by us being in the Premier League because I doubt the share price they’ll get on a sale as a Championship club will be sufficient their risk/reward.
Surely we want to be on real journey to the Prem again
debt free,low overhead lean mean operating football club whats not to like….only the price required to set us free that and do they really want to sell ?
Three good and sensible comments here and ,imo, one of Dan’s best Blogs..
i put my money where my mouth is by spending over a grand a year on season tickets
every season for god knows how many years, by buying all the latest kits and merchandice
every season, by spending fortunes on food and drink inside st. andrews every home game,
if i was a millionaire i would definetley help blues help financualy whenever i could but ime a
working man with a family of bluenoses and i think i spend more than enough in helping my
club on and off the pitch, its upto others to have the same commitment and try and help
blues get back to where we were a few years ago.KRO.
Dan,
Do you have any idea of the names of potential HK buyers and timescales?,
Nope
Now its either because CY is foreign or that he doesn’t speak good English or even because he doesn’t speak to “US” at all, that many presume that he is a clown and doesn’t know what he is doing. People need to remember that he is very well educated and very well connected in his homeland. He is no mug and holding out for a price to suit him and the shareholders proves that, although some regard that as stupidity. I think CY deserves some respect as a businessman and a human being. Some of the fans comments are embarrassing and shameful.
Dunno about educated mate, he left school at 15. Agree with the rest though.
Just because Yeung left school at 15, it doesn’t mean that he’s uneducated.
For instance, I left skool at 13, going on 14 at the time, and I’m . . . . oh, hang on, I see what you mean. ;-)
Brilliant !!!!
Yea because an educated man with all the right connections would pay 81 million for a business that’s not worth half that, blokes a f*cking idiot
Any deal that leaves Pannu supposedly in charge and receiving his inflated contract is unacceptable to me. Also the reason I personally don’t want new owners from Hong Kong is twofold, firstly I want no connection with CY or his buddies, secondly there have been two examples of Hong Kong ownership in British football, at our club and Portsmouth, both have been unmitigated financial disasters.
So we were a wonderful tale of success when the Coombes and Wheldon were in charge , were we ?
Chas
Dont connect Clifford Coombes with his son,,,,,,Keith was cast in the same mold as the recent [and present] owners,,,,,he was a loan shark pure and simple, Clifford did his best for the club,,,,Keith just wanted the money,,,Wheldon was the same as Yeung in many ways, the only difference was Wheldon sold what he could then got out,,,,,,,,The Kumars tried but unlike now,,,,their BANK was dodgy and went belly up,,,,,not them,,,,if the bank hadnt folded Administration wouldnt have taken place enabling the “Brady Bunch” to step in,,,,,and the rest we all know.
Clifford Coombes always had the best interests of the club at heart
weldon’s era was tough times, but who else came in- no one. players had not been paid, bills had not been paid, the cream had been taken by coombes and if you think its dark days now you must not have been going down then. 4,000 gates and no sign of light. the club is now very well run , but as usual there is always someone pissing on our chips. keep the faith, and KRO
I have always believed he wanted to continue to run the club. Nothing changes that as I don’t believe he would sell unless somebody offered him silly money. However much we feel this isn’t what we want – we are now a Chinese Club – that’s the global economy!! Carson and his investors thought BCFC could make money – it still can with some investment and a return to the Premier league – in 3 seasons he could be in profit. That’s how he would see it from a business perspective. The only way fans can influence it is by owning a part – my 1000 shares in BCFC give me nothing by way of influence. Influence has to be bought and that takes big bucks.. The Blues Trust AGM mandated the Board of the Trust to set up a vehicle for fans and investors to buy into if ever there was a realistic possibility of getting a toehold into the Club. I would do it. I wonder how many others would?
I would!…but it needs someone who knows how we could do it get the ball rolling. I said before that I would be prepared to pay a monthly fee so that the we could get a share in our club .I’m sure many would also be prepared to jump on board.
Getting realistic and practical aims and objectives would be a decent enough way to start. Set a target amount and identify how the purchase will take place, who from (a possible big enough shareholder who might want out?) and most importantly at the right price. Have a professional organisation act on behalf of the group.
Organise a plan of eventual outcomes. Get as many folks on-board as possible. Doesn’t matter if at first people buy shares through the Trust or off their own backs; get them out of the hands of others and into the pockets of Bluenoses here in the UK. One GBP or one hundred GBPs spent by individuals with the interest of the club getting shares will mean growing interest and influence.
I would say that a 5% stake for a low seven figure sum should be the goal (no pun intended). I have a feeling that the new investors coming on-board or hoping to, will want a bigger say in operations and we may see PP having a smaller say, and hopefully a reflective pay packet, in how things are directed in future.
If and when the shares are relisted and the Trust have put in place a modus operandi, I shall pledge a five figure sum towards its target amount.
Top comment.
You would have to be a mug to put money into an organisation,run by these faceless people in Hong Kong. Pannu has creamed a fortune off the club and contributed nothing. Yeung,might be interested in the club,but ultimately,i would think his original thought,when buying the club,was that it was another vehicle,to boost his income. We have learnt from his court case,the amount of questionable deals he has been involved in and the only sensible way to put money into Blues,would be, to buy it outright. To buy a small stake in the club, would be a massive financial risk. There would be very few financial advisers that would recomend putting money into BCFC,while these people hold the rains.
Exactly John, there. Is no way I would give this lot any of my money unless I or my consortium gained at least 51% of the club
John
To try and get a foothold in the club one would have to be a mug?
Also, whilst BIH hold the reins, something needs to be done to try and wrest some control from HK and back to the UK. Any suggestions?
Carlos
In an ideal world 51% would be super, who’s gonna stump up the 15m GBPs to do so?
Fans.
15 million GBP between 30,000 fans is £500 each.
That ain’t a lot really is it? Price of a season ticket?!!!!!
Makes you think doesn’t it?…..
I agree with you that another Chinese or HK-based investor/owner is not necessarily a bad thing. Just because BIH were utterly incompetent in terms of corporate governance, internal controls and general business and commercial acumen, it doesn’t mean that all Chinese/HK business people are. Also, I take comfort from the League’s financial fair play rules, which I believe prevent owners from loading their club’s balance sheets with excessive debt, preventing the kind of mess that other clubs such as Portsmouth have got into.So if a new owner was to invest in the infrastruture of the club, particularly replacing the main stand and securing the highest category academy status, plus help us to be competetive on the pitch without paying out silly money, and crucially as well they communicate properly with the supporters, then I don’t care where they are from. Oh, and they don’t make us play in red…
Another excellent blog Ajamajir. I am convinced that there have been other issues apart from the price that CY has supposedly been demanding that have blocked the possibility of a sale of the club. If these new restructuring arrangements do come into force following a re-listing of the shares of BIH then I am sure it makes the club potentially saleable as many barriers to a sale will have been removed. BIH is currently a “can of worms” for any potential investor and I believe that those stumping up the cash must be either motivated by a quick sale following a relisting or by taking over shortly after. It is one hell of a risk for these new investors to pump money into this mess at the moment and they must have a clear idea of what their exit is. One things for certain they haven’t invested for the love of BCFC or because it it is a profitable trading company. I think we will go into administration early next year if the re-structuring is either blocked by the Department of Justice or if the shares aren’t re-listed. If the re-structuring is successful them surely the new investors will want a quick return by a sale soon after.
Would you be so happy if they wanted Blues to play in red as it’s a “lucky” colour? Or change our name like Cardiff? Get real chaps who wants Chinese ownership? When was the last time we heard anything from them or had a presence in the UK?
It’s happening at Hull (name change) and Derby too (stadium name change.) Also, it happened at Newcastle (stadium name change.) It’s not just the Chinese messing with tradition. They’re all at it!
I’ve heard of a joint bid from Aston Martin and James Villas, they also want to rename St Andrews to reflect their business names!!
James Martin ?
LOL, well CY/PP have been cooking the books for years ;-)
Dan, I think the reason we dont want HK/Chinese investors or ownership of the club is because we as fans have felt the ‘loss’ of ownership. With the club in the hands of someone as remote as CY, we feel like the club is no longer ours. This is our first taste of foreign ownership, and it tastes damned rotton!
When things go wrong, we need to be able to vent our spleen against someone who is here and visible (regardless of how futile that is) and who might actually give a damn. Im not saying that CY doesnt give a damn, but how would we know??
What if they appointed a uk based chairman?
I think there has to be some sort of UK based direction, objectives and answerability. Good idea.
I agree with Dan’s last comments, fans having a stake in the club is definitely the way forward I believe and it connects the club with the people in the city. Maybe this is something the Blues Trust could have a look at but I would definitely be involved if I could. A person with some financial know-how would need to be on board too.
They are – but if its to succeed people will need to back it
I am in full agreement Bob. We need to be led and the trust is the perfect vehicle if handled properly . I would contribute without doubt and what about the famous blues supporters they could help in many ways. How much would we need to raise AJ Kro4ever
You need £30 million to buy the club let alone future investment. 10,000 hard nosed Bluenoses. That would mean each one of us chips in £3000??
10% of the Club would that be achievable amongst 10,000 ?
Just as has been pointed out recently with the Protest Groups “likes” on Facebook dont equate to doing something in reality.The Blues Trust at its recent AGM was given a Mandate by its membership to look into Supporter Investment and report back the findings,now whilst there is no time limit for this to done i can assure you it is being looked into.Important to note that this is only on behalf of Trust Members but the stronger the Trust becomes then the idea could and i say could become a reality
Another great insight to the plight of BCFC.
I was one that claimed the only way forward was through the administration system, following Tuesday’s announcement, like you, think this can only be good for the future of BCFC short term and with the right investment long term.
As mentioned Tuesday this is still to be sanctioned by the shareholders, so maybe a case of not counting chickens might be appropriate until the shareholders decision.
As for investment, I don’t care whether it comes from my grandsons piggy bank or some Chinese multi-millionaire, if it is going to put a decent team capable of competing at the highest level then why not, as long as we don’t buy and agree high profile contracts that could bankrupt us.
We still need to be sensible and run as a business in the same way we are now.
Fans need to start turning up and putting their money back into the club, this will only enhance the sale of the club or investment to potential clients.
KRO
I see that the Sisu boss, the company which owns Coventry City, has stated that the club will not be selling players in January and will hold onto their current crop of young players. In fact the manager has been told he can buy. Its interesting because due to financial fair play rules a club cannot spend more than 60% of their revenue. An example given is that if Coventry bought a player for £150,000 then the owners would have to inject £250,000 extra income into the club. No income is coming into Birmingham from BIH and I doubt they would want to inject extra income on top of a transfer fee, as for selling in January, lets have a statement from Carson or Pannu just like the Sisu boss had the guts to.
I think we should all get down to the ground of our beloved team, and give the lads and Lee Clarke all the support and passion as only us blue nose’s know how to do. Pack the stadium out again and get the noise levels raised so the hair on the back of your neck stands us. That would say to CY, Pannu YOU WILL NEVER BEAT US.WE ARE BLUES THROUGH AND THROUGH.
The quicker the club is sold, to someone that has got pride, passion, about our great club the better. And re-appoint Michael Wiseman to the board, and get some old blues players on the coaching/ board who know how to assoicate with the blues fans. Palladini, Trevor Francis, Jasper Carrot, Bev Bevan. Who would get bums on seats. And no we do not want anyone changing our name of the ground or our Royal Blue shirts. Like out anthem THE BOYS IN ROYAL BLUE. WE hold the City’s name we are proud of it. Not proud of what these owners are doing to our great club.
Well said Debbie Kro
I will KRO Glynn and hopefully all our other Blue Nose’s will do the same.
KRO Debbie
well said,the most sensible words i have heard in a long time,we should forget all about the madness going on behind the scenes and get ourselves down stans like we used to.
Why would having Michael Wiseman at the helm be good for BCFC? With all due respect to him and his family he was no more than a figurehead for this and the previous board whilst his father and grandfather were chairmen when we pottered along unambiguously underachieving throughout their tenure. They never built on the Arthur Turner years and when the maximum wage ended wouldn’t compete so we fell into the old Second Division for the best part of a decade
Unambitioniously
how could you trust CY as you call him -to sell his shares, raise monies, and investment from whom? we do not know ? FURTHERMORE -who owns all the other shares? more paper trail, more deceiving webs, CY will do what is best for him not BCFC-that is for sure, I often wonder whether you are a journalist, stock-broker or accountant, perhaps all three, whilst I appreciate your very interesting articles and respect your opinions, I wonder how anyone could agree to letting a totally incapable hairdresser make decisions at all- for CY its all about saving face, keeping his cronies and other investors happy, and salvaging BIHLetc,before BCFC is even considered, and of course being Pannus cash cow-and please note I have worked everyday for the last 30 years with the Chinese in business, so I think I know just a little-most of those I deal with are honourable-not as sure as you about on CY and Pannu?
i think you just eaten your own words no administration, debt free…………….kro gerard
Andy, I think the lack of communication has been the single biggest issue between CY and fans. Most listed companies will publish a strategy and give investors and shareholders a sense of where the company is heading and how they will get there. If BIHL just gave everyone some sense of the long game without the need for smoke and mirrors and all this mystery and intrigue then he’d get more support from the fan base. The deafening silence just leads to suspicion and mistrust.
A great article Dan and I wholly support the raising of funds to try to ensure some of the club returns to the hands of the fans. I have written to you privately and to the Blues Trust (of which I am a member) on this very point.
I have been a supporter of Blues for some 60 years or so and am a season ticket holder. I am appalled at the current state of the financial side of the Club and the fact that we the fans seem unable and helpless to do anything about it. The current parent company, BIHL, because of the predicament of its major shareholder, does not appear to nor will have sufficient capital to support BCFC as a going concern and unless something is done soon, the football club seems seriously likely to go into administration in the not too distant future and if it does then demotion to a lower division would likely follow.
I feel that the time has come to stir up some action. The Club is desperately short of funds and we don’t seem to be getting anywhere and nothing will progress unless we take a pro-active approach. I am not interested in making any kind of protest because I don’t think it will achieve anything.
We as fans need to do something really positive to secure the very existence of our Club and for our children who will be its future supporters. How about we (probably as part of the Blues Trust) set up a company to try to raise funds, from all interested parties, in an attempt to make a serious bid to acquire a substantial shareholding in Birmingham City Football Club, from its parent company BIHL? The funds raised could be added, if required, to any existing consortium that may be waiting in the wings. I would like the Club or a substantial part of it to be a Community Owned Club. I do not want the Club to be owned by any foreign-based investor(s).
Before the current owners took control, I along with many other supporters, owned some shares in it but I was forced to relinquish my shareholding on the takeover. I would willingly reinvest if I was allowed to do so and I am sure that a lot of others would do the same.
I would like a company, to be owned by all or a majority of Blues fans, to attempt to raise sufficient capital to be able to share control. I have thought of opening a website to test the fan base by asking you what amount of capital you might each commit or pledge in say £1 shares in such a company. This would give an indication of the extent of the fund that could perhaps be generated.
Ultimately and if there is sufficient interest, a new company could be formed and shares issued. Each interested party could apply for as many shares as they could afford and they could add to that shareholding later if they wish. Mr Palladini and his consortium, or any other consortium for that matter, could each or collectively be part of the overall plan. It seems from Press reports that the Palladini consortium could commit about £20 million. I feel that up to another £10 million could perhaps be generated from the fans in various denominations, small or large. Obviously some would not be able to afford a lot but conversely, others may want to subscribe more. An aggregate consortium of £30 million might be sufficient to encourage BIHL to relinquish its ownership. On the share issue, the funds could be deposited in a secure Bank or Escrow account and held there until the appropriate time.
If the Football Club did go in to administration and if my proposed “fans-owned” company was already set up with available and sufficient funds, then it could just be possible to apply to the Administrators to buy all or part of BCFC. We could be at least a minority partner in a consortium and ensure some of the club returns to the hands of the fans.
Please let us do something and see what happens.
great blog again daniel – carson is the daddy anyone got 32mil please step forward, and by the way no administration, and debt free, i wonder if ziggy will stay with our great club on salary of 5-10,000 week after this season??? now that he settled in brum…………..paltry offer by GP OH dear………………………….
Now the time to unite under one banner, and support the team and manager,………….kro Blackpool here we come…………………………
Ziggy isnt worth £5k a week!!!
maybe you are right!! i would interested at the end of the season obviously then his present contract would have expired…………………
Somehow I can’t see him going from £60k to £5k… or even £10k. That’s a mighty drop.
Maybe on a pay-as-you-play contract, but nothing else. He’s been injured a fair bit since he joined us… and his back certainly won’t be getting any better. So, if he does stay, I think a p-a-y-p contract would be better for us.
I don’t think Paladini’s offer was paltry.He’s offered what we’re worth.
I would be happy to purchase between £500 and £1,000 of shares in the club via the Trust or another appointed party. There you are first pledge which you can hold me to.
I would also be happy to purchase shares if available, can the blues trust organise this . In the mean time we must keep our club in the championship, the key to this will be our home form. We need the same type of vocal support that is produced at away games. Blackpool next home game kids for a quid come on let’s try and fill the ground the young blues team needs us now.
KRO
I agree with the vocal support, the noise levels away have been out of this world, put a lot of the home teams supporters to shame.
What happens to those supporters at St Andrews? Sometimes the ground is like a morgue, quiet and lacking in atmosphere.
We need St Andrews to be a fortress again, now there is a light at the end of the tunnel will the stay aways return? I doubt it, they will still cry that CY is still in control, maybe so, but it will only be temporary until either he is found guilty or we are sold, but the end of his and BIHL is nigh and they are beginning to prepare for it.
Let those still loyal to BCFC, whatever we have thrown at us sing from the same song sheet and sing out LOUD…
KRO+DNM
Good article apart from:
“If fans can’t put their money where there mouth is why should they expect anyone else to?”
do you include yourself in that statement?
bit of a difference between a bunch of fans who earn on average 28k per year and a chairman with millionaire investors, in-fact fans invest yearly in season tickets which can be a big chunk of their wages.
Yes I do, of course I do. I have no capital to speak of at the moment but when it comes I will most definitely be part of it
bluepete, the trust, etc. Count me in but not declaring an amount
Good piece Pete I pledge a £1000 that’s 3 of us Kro4ever
on top of 13,000 fans that should be about 13,000 pounds – not taking kids in account who might have season tickets………….and probably couldn’t afford a thousand pounds Carson paid 81mil, now asking for 32mil………….we will light years way………… and so is GP……………
Imo,we’re not worth £32 mill.
Mark you keep going on about debt free and no admin, but we could go on for years like that something needs to give. We have to get back to the premiership for that to happen we need serious cash.
Yeung is happy just to retain control, well I want him out and his mate Pannu. Reading these blogs it is obvious that there are people who know what they are talking about regarding dealing with the chinese and a way forward ie Gerard,Blue Pete, and others. We should take note of what they say and act accordingly.
Tony…………… all fans have an opinion mate put your money where your mouth is quote……………i wait in anticipation……………..
Carson mandate pretty clear find 32mil,and we talk……….or maybe i wont……….i dont think you can get it any clearer than that my friend…………………
Mark, why have you started posting in staccato ? :-o
£32 mill and we talk…….or maybe i won’t. How the f8ck is that clear.
basically Carson decides no one else, people have thrown in gp, administration, his loan,us going to the wall, thought Carson would be on his backside………..no mate
can anyone tell me the latest with carsons court case ? last I heard the case was continuing after his application for a permanent stay was rejected
Richard – it’s adjourned until December 12 now for final submissions.
Let’s not write off a billion plus Chinese and many more billions of foreign investors because of one painful experience.
The dream is of course to have a very wealthy fan as an owner… until one steps forward, I don’t care about the nationality of our future owner. A respect for the club and a proper channel of communication is the acceptable minimum. And a bit of cash!
After listening to Paladini over the past 12 months or so, it is pretty clear he wants the club and he will keep trying until he is given a yes or no answer by Carson. The last I heard, Paladini said he would walk away and move on if he is told the club wont be sold to him.
Perhaps Zigic will buy the club!
LOL!
Maybe Ziggy could employ Yeung as the club’s hairdresser?
your right BoobyBlue, were not gonna get a local bluenose with millions to buy the club
and spend millions on players, otherwise they would have thrown there hat in the ring by now
so, like yourself i dont care who buys the club as long as they respect, communicate and
spend a few quid on the club, that will do for me. KRO.
Absolutely. Respect and communication is the very least we should expect.
I think if they’d shown that, CY and PP would have been more accepted. It’s true, they’re hated by a lot of fans, but it’s often been self-inflicted.
Great piece Dan.
Think it shows again that these guys ARE actual real life businessmen and actually know their way around businesses.
I for one will hold my hands up and say that I wanted CY sent down just because I wanted the club sold, regardless of his innocence or not.
I’ll take it back, and say that i hope he goes down if he’s guilty, but otherwise we have to understand that the club will be sold on his terms.
Hi Dan ,Perhaps a rather simplistic answer,but Cy could perhaps build bridges by removing PP from his acting chairman role appoint someone from within St Andrews ie Julia Shelton or Roger Lloyd as CEOthus saving a very large salary PPs and show all Bluenoses that he cares and has genuine faith inall StAndrews personnel
I can’t see PP being removed but maybe with PP being CEO and MD of BIH he could appoint a Birmingham based vice-chairman to be the figurehead here?
I admire all who state they would purchase shares if and when they became available but remember most people invest if they can see a payback in their investment most do not do it for the love of the share ! You can certainly put me down to invest an amount and I certainly would look at it as not an investment to get a payback but purely the love of the club and city (but don’t tell the wife !!)
By the way you really do not want a multi-millionaire you need a billionaire to invest for the long term future it’s as simple as that
I wish the club would be sold. I could invest 20 grand
Comment removed – libel reasons – do not repost
I’m just waiting for a sheikh to buy us and pay 100m for ronaldo.
I wouldn’t care if it was Sheik Y’Money, as long as he gets us back on an even keel and gives us half a chance of competing.
EDITED VERSION
Firstly why would anyone want to risk investing in the shambles that is BIHL?
Simple,the same reason somebody would buy the club for 2 and a half times what its worth,the same reason someone would loan the club £15 million but not have proper paper work
Secondly why is that loan under the the restraint order,i though all the money laundering charges were concerned with events before BCFC was bought biy BIHL
And thirdly we will never get enough fans to chip in funds to amount to anything near approaching enough,most can not even be bothered to go down to support the team anymore
dont rule out the last part…It can be done and if we do end up with ownership that encourages us ie indicates that they would be willing to dilute their holding and invite supporters on board then we would be prepared and ready.If that day were not to come funds held in Eskrow would be returned
Could it happen yes it could
will it happen,we will never know if we dont at least try
Well said B25dave. See my post above. We need to ignore the negative things and try our best to make things happen. We, as a fans consortium, don’t have to invest in BIHL. We can attempt to invest directly in BCFC by acquiring shares in it from BIHL, if its shareholders will permit it, along with any other consortium that is trying to acquire an interest.
Answer to number 2 – because all of Carson’s assets are under the restraint order.
……..pannu did very little in 2 years to gain progress…….must go ,….carson will find it hard to be trusted but seems to have paladini some unyielding likeness for the club …paladini proved to get success before,……lee clark did not impress to start with but fans have warmed to him ..with the team scoring 4 goals in3 of the games ….3 goals in 4 of the games,..and losing by 1 goal to a few clubs near the top their aint much wrong with the squad despite the low position in the table,, until around april its as dan said qua sera ……but st Andrews is safe the club should be safe ..the players should be safe…but there is one thing that is certain .and that if we the fans get behind this squad and roar it to a lot higher things then there will be a lot of cash thown blues way ….I don’t know about you lot but I am sick of feeling sorry for myself ,so lets get this show on the road ,,,.,lets make these other teams pay for our unhappy times ,…lets get bums on seats ,lets tear this league apart we are Birmingham city fc ,…no mercy .lets make that light at the end of the tunnel an inferno ,……COME ON ,…..k.r.o
Sappy Sad
I agree with you. I’ve not been going down, but I don’t feel good about it.
It makes me sad and I’ve realised that this is part of the test that is being a blues fan.
Since Brucie took us up to the Pem we’ve had it pretty good. We’re used to disasters at blues. We deserved the good times because we put up with all those bad times. Ok they’re back, let’s get on with it.
Let’s get the crowds back above the 20,000 mark. Lets get behind OUR blue boys!!!
Let’s be proper blues supporters !!!!!!
Perhaps when we finally get rid of all the high earners off the wage books then we can rise again with the right investment. Who wants to pay Zigic’s wages for the remainder of the season?
I think we just need to concentrate on surviving both financially and in the league this year. This latest step seems a positive step as it hopefully frees up capital and also makes it easier to sell the club later on?
So somebody is going to put some money in to keep us afloat that’s ok but we need more than that we need players half decent players not just loans and freebies that nobody wants so nothing is going yo change we will just keep struggling. All this is going to do is get fans backs up and the stay away fans will keep doing that stay away the only thing that will bring fans back is proper investment so we can buy some proper players just gets better & better being a blues fan totally fed up with the whole thing we need to be rid of these Chinese owners ASAP.
Maybe the loyal BCFC fans who still support the team are just as fed up with the Chinese owners, and maybe they want rid just the same. Yes we are fed up with the fact that we have a manager trying his best with next to no funds to buy players and yes we are fed up that we have good performances like Stoke City and Swansea then follow up with bad results like Charlton, Burnley and Leeds.
But what I am fed up with is so called supporters who stay away then come onto here and other blogs complaining, maybe BCFC, Lee Clark and the players would be better off if they kept their comments to themselves and let the rest of us GET BEHIND THE TEAM, and yes I have been to every game home and away this season and supported the Ladies on Wednesday…
KRO+DNM
Imo people’s lack of desire for a new Chinese investor is based on several things I.e. Obviously the lack of physical presence from the owner at matchdays and poor open communication from Camp Carson has been a issue aswell as the circus surrounding the club. Also I believe Yeung has his fingers in more pies than Pukka can make so my concern would be what other potential dubious handshake could be made on the back of a deal with one of his friendly investors.. Sorry the sceptic in me has teamed up with my disillusioned side. Going forward regarding the potential investment of shares by the fans I totally agree that this is the best way for the fans and the club at this moment in time. Apologies for sounding all doom and gloom. Lol..
I like many fellow bluenoses have been feeling pretty depressed about the recent events in HK and of course the lack of credible information being fed back to the heart of our club,which of course is all of us supporters.The information on OP has been the only bright light and I thank everyone for their frank views,whether I agree or not.The news this week is definitely of an improvement and as a director of a company myself,I at least can see that it shows that within BIHL there are credible businessmen who have made some decisions.I for one have had a better week.
Going forward I think from my own point of view I need to get down to Stans and start to show the team how much the club means to me.I have sat for nearly 18 months doing nothing but watching out for results and feeling good and bad accordingly.You supporters who have been with the team deserve the utmost respect and I applaud you all for your efforts in keeping the team going.I am a previous season ticket holder for over 25 years and feel ashamed at how ive let the team down recently.
The only thing we as fans can do is support the team in numbers and of course vocally which is the least they should expect from me.My intention is to get to the Blackpool game and every game after and I think we should all if at all possible encourage others to do the same.I sat in the Tilton for years and we have all seen teams wilt at the noise we create.Forget negative its time to back the team and show the other people of our city that we may be a club on a downer but that in know way will we just lie down and accept what comes our way.We have always been fighters and its time we started fighting back,the club needs us.I hold my hands up and apologise to the club for my lack of commitment.We all know people like me and we all need to stoke them up.Lets aim for 20,000 plus against Blackpool and start from there,
Forget Pannu and forget the moans,we will deal with that when we need to.I will buy shares in any fund set up to get our views heard for a start.At the end off the day its our club and long after the owners have sold up and gone we will still be here.Ive bought 4 shirts and a season ticket today so lets start now.I think its been a good week and think we should roll with it after everything that’s gone on previously.KRO
Very honest mate. Credit to you.
“I’ve seen the wailing and gnashing of teeth that the club may remain in foreign ownership and I have to admit that I don’t fully understand it. I don’t think it matters where the money for the club is coming from as long as someone invests in it ”
Like where YEUNG got his money from mayor??yeh I would really like to go down this road again someday…..wake up and smell the coffee,the place is in tatters because of that feckin idiot in h.k…..
P.s.no more Chinese owners……..
bored of saying it – swansea fc are the blueprint and business plan for all professional football clubs- i will buy shares if the trust lead the way !!
Although the concept of fan ownership sounds reasonable I suspect that the amounts the Swansea trust paid for their club are considerably lower than that needed to buy a significant interest in Blues.
They initially bought the whole club for £20k (not million). They then immediately had to declare its debts as unpayable and any creditors settled for a fraction of what they were owed, via a CVA.
Eventually they ended up buying a 20% share of the club for £200k, valuing the club at “just” £1m.
All bluenoses should join the supporter’s Trust. It costs £5 and it gives us fans our best voice to the club. The work they have done re an Assett of Community Value is a credit to the Trust’s current board.
Put your money where your mouth is!
I spent 1k the last time that shares were sold in the club. I believe these shares were written off when Cy purchased the club. How ever much I love BCFC, once bitten twice shy.
If you didn’t sell your shares in BC PLC they are still yours and you still have a stake in the club.
I’ve never trusted and still don’t trust the current regime. They are shady, vague and not even capable of submitting accounts on-time. Whatever steps they have put into place recently are to benefit themselves, any benefit to the club being coincidental. They have asset stripped the club almost to the end with only the ground remaining.
On the flip-side I don’t care if a foreign owner came in – as long as they are not associated with CY. Just look what foreign owners have done for Chelsea or Man City.
Dan – I would to think the new investment will help the football side in January. If this is possible this will help clark fresh up our team…….whether fans like or not money was used to get caddis, and this polish international……..i feel imo we may get more surprises………dan you were admament before we couldnt p*ss in a pot………so we all need to wait in anticipation……….
I’d be shocked if Lee Clark was given anything to spend in January. But, if Carson Yeung has been watching every game on dvd.. surely he can see that, just a half-decent investment on the playing side could see us pushing for a play-off spot. At this moment, we’re only 10 points off 6th place… a couple of quality, maybe experienced (Championship) players could help us bridge that gap. Maybe Dudka will prove to be one of those. I hope so.
Ever heard of a comma? Struggling to breathe after reading this
Oh dear.. David Murphy is going to be out until at least Xmas and maybe into the new year. Curse of the full backs yet again.
Are people forgetting the court case is not finished yet we still wait the result of that if cy goes to prison it changes the scenario completely and then we get the process of appeal to contend with op has done a fantastic job keeping us informed but if cy is in prison bihl wont tell us anything nor wl pp so I suggest caution at the moment it could be sometime before fans can do anything so lets support them on the pitch kro
Sorry Dan putting money into BCFC is one thing and as a previous shareholder I would have no problem with that, but putting money into BIHL no chance. Look what happened some months ago, did not Pannu set up a system to bypass the small shareholders having a say ? I think rather than giving the fans a say it is supporting the current regime, which has to go.
God help us if a another Far East outfit gets involved. These latest developments change nothing for me.
Eamon, ,my thoughts too, had shares from both previous share issues, as there was a certain amount of trust at the time that the business was run correctly and the board had the cash for the hard times.
This time there is no trust and i could only invest if the fans had a major share of at least 51%.
Yeung, with this deal wants to massively dilute the shareholding of the existing shareholders, so whose to say he wouldn’t do that again even if the fans owned 10 or 20 per cent, we couldn’t stop him and your money would be all but lost and any voting power we had would be diminished.
I couldn’t trust someone who pays £80 million for something that was trading on the UK Aims market with a value of around £44 million, who bought players without relegation clauses (suicide management) and had to take out loans just to pay premiership wages.
How many other clubs have had new owners or new investors yet still struggled or made more mistakes.
Portsmouth, Wolves, Chester, Ebbsfleet, Derby, QPR, Leeds, Darlington, Palace, Notts County, Ipswich, Coventry, Sheff Weds, Boston, Vale, Swindon, etc and this season Fulham so far really struggling.
Even Leicester maybe at the top but according to web their debt is around £50 million mostly to the owners but as at Forest with a death or villa with a owners change of heart on the debt they are owed, the team / club suffers.
New investors don’t always improve matters.
Time to cut ties with David Murphy. his injury record is appaling he misses more games than he plays,pity he is a good player but we are not gewtting value for money with him.
I said the same last season. Considering he joined us in 2008, he’s only played about 100 games.. and he’ll be lucky to reach 15-20 games this season. It’s a shame, because he’s a good player.
The club isn’t debt free is it? The club still has the ground in mortgage at HSBC doesn’t it?
It’s not much at all, less than a million. maybe less than half.
Oh dear, doom & gloom again….what if
Perhaps we should be taking one step back, reflect on the investment that Mr Yeung made prior to his unfortunate house arrest.
Maybe….just maybe? He is rightfully acquitted, and maybe he pops over to StAns and puts his hand deep into his pocket, says I’m sorry!… and pulls out an enormous investment wedge, and invites the fans to elect a voluntary shadow chairman, whilst extending the hand of friendship to Mr Palladini
Together they launch a master plan…..
Sorry but track records currently say, this is more likely to happen than a Blue Sky over Stans (and remember the once mooted Jasper – Jeff Lynn – ub40 purchase!!)
Where are we really heading with any of the possible outcomes??
Surely it’s time for TF (the prodigal son) to storm in with some of his mates….. Please
Truly Blue, True Blues Fan :-(